The Pope is a D...! (Yeah I said it!)

[Jordan]

This pisses me off! Coming from the leader of the Religion that turned a blind eye to Priests sampling the altar boys for yrs!

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Pope Benedict said on Monday that saving humanity from homosexual or transsexual behavior was just as important as saving the rainforest from destruction.

"(The Church) should also protect man from the destruction of himself. A sort of ecology of man is needed," the pontiff said in a holiday address to the Curia, the Vatican's central administration.

"The tropical forests do deserve our protection. But man, as a creature, does not deserve any less."

The Catholic Church teaches that while homosexuality is not sinful, homosexual acts are. It opposes gay marriage and, in October, a leading Vatican official called homosexuality "a deviation, an irregularity, a wound."

The pope said humanity needed to "listen to the language of creation" to understand the intended roles of man and woman. He compared behavior beyond traditional heterosexual relations as "a destruction of God's work."

He also defended the Church's right to "speak of human nature as man and woman, and ask that this order of creation be respected."

[marissaaz]

its amazing people believe in these fairytales and take people like "the pope" serious

[flombago]

It's tricky to argue against religion, as wrapped up as it is in emotion, the fear of the unknown, and the tendency of humans to think as a group. I'd warn that militancy will backfire; it's important to find reasoned arguments.

One argument against the Pope is that he's preaching 1000+ year old ideas, and it would not be the first time the Church was wrong in it's interpretation of the Word of God. Remember the whole 6000 year-ago creation thing ? It had a little problem with geological science. Intelligent design (which is popular in religious circles but I don't think the Pope subscribes to it) is another area which conflicts with science, and is more annoying because it's harder to convince the believers of their errors, which they hope to foist onto elementary education curricula.

But GLBT rights and marriage is even more difficult, as it involves morality, which is not a hard science. Tough to make progress here, but I think the morally superior position lies with the gays, with their right to private choices of association and to enjoy the same rights and freedoms as other people. In contrast, the Pope's theory is arbitrary and abstract, something to do with what is "natural" and what "God wants". He's supposed to be listening to God. Well, it's hard to argue with that.

I think sexual morality, like other human rules, evolves towards an optimum which minimizes the conflict of desires among people; however, there may be many optima and we may want to move to another after changes in attitudes and improved understanding.

[Jordan]

Oh I totally agree with you Flombago, I normally stay away from religious issues but this one really irked me. I know we have yrs to go before any progress (if any) will be made.

[Jim Beaux]

66 countries have put a signed declaration to the UN that homosexuality should be decriminalised worldwide.

Every country in the EU signed it - GLBT protection is an integral part of Human Rights.

50+ countries submitted a counter petition, stating that this matter is not for the UN but for individual countries to decide. The main opponents were Islamic states.

The United States declined to sign either. The US signed a similar motion 2 years ago (not 'formally' put to the UN) and also signed a similar motion by whatever-the-name-is-for-the-organisation-of-countries-in-America is called (sorry, can't remember the name) this year. The US declined to sign the current UN one on something like 'this is a matter for individual states, not the Federal govt'. {I'll dig out the 100% accurate version if anybody actually cares.}

I read the Pope's message as a shot across the bows of Obama. Europe went GLBT friendly a while back and I think this was meant for folks in the US.

IF I've read it right, look out for more fireworks. The main battleground is now the United States of America.